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HVAC question & Home warranty?

HVAC question & Home warranty? Topic: Market research documentation
June 26, 2019 / By Ephah
Question: I bought a home in last June 2012 and it came with warranty from Home Warranty company. My Home has a heat pump system with electric heat as back up. Fast forward, my last electric bill was unusually high (Ohio) even though it is winter. I raised a claim with HMS and HMS authorized tech found a leak in my inside air handler unit coil. It was submitted to warranty company for next action. The options provided to me are : 1) HMS Warranty company to replace only the air handler system(current one I have is TRANE) with PAYNE brand. This PAYNE uses R410a refrigerant out of the box and will need conversion to work with R22 refrigerant as my outside unit (existing heat pump) is designed for R22, Also I will need to pay $200 for debris removal and modification of duct work. OR 2) HMS will give a credit for $807 so that I can buy my own system. I did some research and also had a reputable Heating & Cooling system company look at this option #1 (provided above) by HMS Warranty. I am quoting the evaluation from a reputable company as " It is not ethical to replace the air handler only and match it up to a 7 year old heat pump with R22 refrigerant. We need to do the right thing for the customer and replace whole system with a R410 system. When the heat pump fails he will have to change his air handler again because you can't buy R22 heat pump as the old coils of air-handler can't be flushed of the R22 & reused for R410" The above company also conveyed, if they were to do this, they will not replace Air handler alone just because of the risk of having future issues at high percentage. Also, based on my research, with consideration to environment, it is recommended to use R410a system when ever possible. Also I had several telephone conversations with other Heating & Cooling company in my area and they all echo the same analysis as the one I used for second opinion. Also I got a quote for an equivalent system for $4765. Hence the amount per option #2 is very negligible for me as a layman to go out in market and purchase a replacement. They also conveyed that Payne is lower tier model and its quality is not that something to be relied upon. Any HVAC experts here? Would there any be issues if I go with option #1?
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Best Answers: HVAC question & Home warranty?

Cindra Cindra | 4 days ago
Sure the HVAC companies are going to tell you you need a complete system. What business are they in? That's right selling HVAC systems. What you need to tell the warranty company is that they are not going to replace your trane unit with some cheap piece of crap unit. I'm sure if you check your warranty contract it says repair or replace with comparable unit at their discretion. You need to get documentation that the Payne is not comparable. If you think for a minute that the warranty company is going to replace the whole system, you are dreaming. Tell them also that if a new unit needs retrofitting, that is up to them, not you. The warranty is to restore to workable condition. That includes retrofitting. As far as debris removal. Tell the installation company to leave the old unit. There are hundreds of ads in every news paper in the country for free removal of anything metal. Just make the deal with one of those junk dealers that they can have it if they take it all.
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Cindra Originally Answered: HVAC question & Home warranty?
Sure the HVAC companies are going to tell you you need a complete system. What business are they in? That's right selling HVAC systems. What you need to tell the warranty company is that they are not going to replace your trane unit with some cheap piece of crap unit. I'm sure if you check your warranty contract it says repair or replace with comparable unit at their discretion. You need to get documentation that the Payne is not comparable. If you think for a minute that the warranty company is going to replace the whole system, you are dreaming. Tell them also that if a new unit needs retrofitting, that is up to them, not you. The warranty is to restore to workable condition. That includes retrofitting. As far as debris removal. Tell the installation company to leave the old unit. There are hundreds of ads in every news paper in the country for free removal of anything metal. Just make the deal with one of those junk dealers that they can have it if they take it all.

Babette Babette
Yes, you will run into issues. R410a needs roughly 50% more coil surface to operate as designed. Due to chemical variances and differences in the chemical makeup between R410a and R22 they are not interchangable. As it is right now there is no way to effectively run R22 in a R410a coil (or vice versa) and achieve the desired effect of mechanical cooling or heating. When someone says retrofit a system they typically mean re-use existing ducting and sometimes linesets while changing both the indoor and outdoor units. Outdoor units and indoor coils are designed and sized to eachother based on the amount of BTU/H that they will move and on what type of refrigerant they will utilize. If you start mismatching unit sizes and refrigerant types you might get lucky and find a combination that works as an overall R22 system but ultimately it is a long shot that may end up costing you more in the long run while being a big headache to deal with. Right now R22 is effectively banned from new production and import into the US per the Montreal Protocol that the EPA enforces. It is still available for sale and will remain so for some time though. Due to the Montreal protocol there was an influx of production and import before the ban and the price of R22 went as low as $5-$7 / # for a long time. Since the ban of production and import the price has risen to just over $20 / # (prices are rough estimates to end users or customers). The ban also restricts sale of 'new' R22 systems however allows for replacement systems to be sold. Basically you can ship an indoor unit or outdoor unit but you can't ship both together in the same sale. Previously where R22 systems could be shipped 'pre-charged' with R22 refrigerant they now ship 'dry' with no refrigerant due to the ban. I mention all this because it is something to take into account when considering your options for repair or replacement and understanding why the warranty might not cover a new R22 indoor unit out right.. If it were me and I had the money I would take the credit and apply it to an entire new R410a system and would either foot the remainder of the bill or finance it through a loan. If this were not an option I would do more research and locate either an entire R22 indoor unit replacement or just the indoor coil and adjacent parts and take the HMS credit. Ultimately an indoor unit is just a fan and a coil in a big metal box and it is possible to replace just the coil of the indoor unit. If doing this research is above and beyond what you had in mind I would contact more contractors requesting quotes for specifically replacing the R22 coil and/or indoor unit with a like for like replacement. What you'll want to look at is how much it is for a new indoor unit vs just the coil and how much labor would cost for each respectively. I would start by calling the local Trane rep in your area first to see if you could purchase the coil or indoor unit yourself. Previously when they shipped 'pre-charged' with refrigerant they couldn't sell the equipment to an individual unless they had an EPA 608 certification. Now that it is illegal to ship them pre-charged with R22 this shouldn't be an issue as it will be shipped 'dry' (slightly pressurized with nitrogen).
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Acacia Acacia
Now I use HVAC because freezing weather for feeling good. You want to know that so http://www.thehvacsource.com/ and freezing sound system. My friend & other relative using HVAC because 100% service warranty.
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Sydney Sydney
you are not replace outside unit right, air handler is dry (no freon inside it) i would call couple more A/C company just replacing inside
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Sydney Originally Answered: Personal finance question. I want to take out a home equity to buy a rental property. Any advice?/?
Whooo - you seem to be in such a hurry. Taking out a home equity in your parents house puts there house at risk. If payments aren't made they lose their house. Usually, the Home Equity Loan is separate from the 1st mortgage. So if you are paying the home equity loan your parents current mortgage amount should be the same. Some things to consider: You have an internship not a full time job. Even a full time job is somewhat risky in this economy as businesses and governments are still laying off people and new job growth is weak. See if a bank would lend you the money based on your current financial situation. I tend to doubt it. If I am correct there is a reason for that. They have experience is knowing what is a good or bad risk. (Despite a recent debacle due to greed and the ability to offload bad loans to others) A 450k house bought 8 years ago may only be worth 350k now better check that out. I am surprised that i am still reading that houses are still losing value. Maybe the area you are interested in is ok. I assume that you have little practical experience in buying rental properties, being a landlord, and evaluating and maintaining rental properties. If true then you may quickly be over your head. You may be handy but some repairs and materials are costly -- and you hopefully will have a full time job. A co worker of mine bought a rental in Boston. It was a nightmare as far as tenants damaging the place, late rents etc but also found out there was lead paint on the walls and cost her a bundle to fix that. She was gung ho like you when she started and threw in the towel. Both her and her husband had good jobs. My advice is to pay off your debt. Make sure you have a full time job. Save some money so you have some reserves to fall back on. And then consider a plan to buy rental property - hopefully on your own credit not your parents home equity. Good Luck

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